Episode 11: The Mighty Oat
March 21st, 2019
Host: Brian Birnbaum
Guest: Christopher Gonzalez
Produced by Katie Rainey
Transcripts by Jonathan Kay
For this eleventh episode of the Animal Riot Podcast, your fearless leader and arbitrarily-selected host, Brian Birnbaum, teams up with his producer(s), Katie Rainey, to welcome Christopher Gonzalez, a writer of fiction and nonfiction, editor at Barrelhouse Magazine, and digital production associate at Macmillan. After dedicating roughly half the episode to Chris's newly exalted status as an oat milk influencer, we move on to the writing community's love affair with Twitter, sexual realization in today's society, and take a moment to hear Chris read a flash fiction piece that will put you in the mood for seafood & sex & sadness.
>> Brian: Welcome to the 11th episode of the Animal Riot Podcast brought to by Animal Riot, a literary press for books that matter. I'm your host Brian Birnbaum. We're here today with Christopher Gonzalez, a writer of fiction and non-fiction, a fiction editor at Barrel House Magazine, and one of the hottest new influencers on social media.
>> Katie: Woo.
>> Brian: And with us is our lovely producers Katie Rainey.
>> Katie: I'm many people.
>> Brian: Chris, what exactly are you an influencer for? The people need to know
>> Katie: We want to know
>> Chris: Oat milk (laughter)
>> Brian: Oat milk.
>> Katie: I want to know how to be a brand ambassador, an influencer. I want to be an oat milk model. Tell me how to do this.
>> Brian: Oh wow. That's ambitious
>> Chris: An oat milk model? Not even just an influencer? (laughs)
>> Katie: I don't know. To me they are synonymous because all I see are influencers on social media who are models.
>> Chris: Yeah, I'm not quite a model. I'm perfect for Twitter because you don't need to necessarily see my face.
>> Brian: That's bullshit. You're gorgeous (laughs)
>> Katie: So how did you come onto this oat milk journey?
>> Chris: Oh God. Like I do with everything, I just tweet randomly / mindlessly. Don't even think too much about it. I mean if you look through my Twitter then you'll find a bunch of typo ridden tweets because I just fire them off. And this one in particular... which I pulled up to read... I think.
>> Brian: We're going to do a little Twitter reading. It's everything we were against 5 minutes ago (laughs)
>> Katie: Were we?
>> Chris: But now we are all onboard.
>> Brian: But now that we have an oat milk influencer here, I mean, let's get in on the bandwagon. Alright shoot.
>> Chris: Yeah so the tweet that changed my life (laughter) I tweeted it on February 9th "It is with a heavy heart that I must admit that oat milk lives up to the hype. I'm working through what that means for my life, my brand. I will be taking no further questions at this time." (laughter) And I just fired it off and...
>> Brian: That was the initial? That was the original oat milk tweet?
>> Chris: That was the original oat milk tweet.
>> Brian: So this has all happened in the past 3 weeks?
>> Chris: Yeah I was thinking about that on my way up here. It feels like 6 months but also it's just been 3 weeks.
>> Katie: And now you're on a podcast talking about oat milk (laughs)
>> Brian: So what's the deal? Like what's going on now? Are you making millions or are you on the path to millions? Or are you just trying to get famous and get turnt on oat milk? (laughs)
>> Chris: I'm using it as a stepping stone to my career and probably for a cologne line down the line.
>> Katie: A cologne line?
>> Brian: An oat milk scent. Chocolate raspberry (laughs)
>> Katie: Ok so I have to admit that I have actually never tried oat milk.
>> Brian: No, but we are about to.
>> Chris: We are about to.
>> Katie: I guess. Well you didn't introduce the challenge.
>> Brian: Guys, this is a literary podcast (laughter). Oh yeah, that's right. Oh my God. That's blasphemous. We have this Hour's Brand of Fuckery every podcast so we are drinking rose but modestly. Abstemiously. Moderately, is the right word. But let's make the challenge about oat milk and about consuming it and not really knowing what it is really other than... is it made out of oats?
>> Chris: It is made of oats.
>> Brian: Oh Alexa wants to chime in here real quick.
>> Chris: (laughs) Oh my God.
>> Katie: What was that? She's got opinions on oat milk.
>> Chris: Wow, is she an oat milk truther?
>> Brian: Yeah I know, right? She's in Twitter going like "what the fuck is this?"
>> Katie: Oh milk truther (laughs). Ok so we are going to try it?
>> Brian: And we don't know what allergies or other afflictions we might have. So that's the challenge. We might die.
>> Chris: I can tell you right now what it is free from.
>> Katie: Ok
>> Chris: Maybe not. Maybe that's not as exciting.
>> Brian: No, I'm actually riveted (laughter) but I want to know and then drink it anyway.
>> Chris: Yeah I mean, it's free from artificial colors, tree nuts, soy, peanuts, lactose, gluton, dairy, artificial preservatives, and artificial flavors.
>> Brian: Wait a second... oat milk is free from gluten?
>> Katie: Ok you would think that this is actually like pla... what is it called? Planet Oak?
>> Chris: Planet Oat, yeah.
>> Brian: (laughs) Planet Oak. We're Planet Oak. We make oak's milk.
>> Katie: Right now you would think they actually paid us. Like you just chimed in "Wait a minute!" (laughter) "It's free from soy milk?"
>> Brian: That's actually really true. I just realized my long lost career in advertising.
>> Katie: I think Planet Oak...
>> Brian: Yeah Planet Oak (laughs)
>> Katie: I think Planet Oat owes us some money here (laughs)
>> Brian: Yeah, we will hit them up. We'll break their knees in a little bit.
>> Chris: I can read their description and really seal the deal (laughs).
>> Katie: Ok yeah. Read it. Let's hear this. We need to know.
>> Chris: Planet Oat is a new brand of oat milk now available in stores. "A non-dairy beverage, Planet Oat is a full-bodied milk alternative that has great taste, has no sugar added, and boasts nutritional benefits thanks to the mighty oats."
>> Brian: Mmmm
>> Chris: "With its rich creamy texture, Planet Oat is enjoyable by the glass, in cereal, in coffee, and is great for cooking." And I can confirm all of those (laughs)
>> Katie: What did you cook it with?
>> Chris: Hot chocolate.
>> Katie: Ok.
>> Brian: Wait a second. Here's the real question. Can you make oatmeal with oat milk?
>> Chris: I haven't tried that.
>> Brian: That's...
>> Katie: We have a plate of cookies. There's oatmeal cookies on the table. We did get cookies explicitly for this.
>> Brian: Woah. We did.
>> Chris: Is there going to be a dunk challenge?
>> Katie: Ok. I want to try it.
>> Brian: I almost think we need to do a part 2 follow-up because I need to know if you can make oatmeal with oat milk (laughter).
>> Chris: Is there a daily limit to how much oat you can intake?
>> Katie: I don't know.
>> Brian: Are we asking the FDA or are we asking Planet Oat (laughter)
>> Chris: I'm asking for myself because I have consumed a lot of oat over the last couple weeks.
>> Katie: I want to know where you... so you hope this trajectory of oat milk takes you somewhere?
>> Chris: Not at all (laughter). I'm enjoying it. They sent me 4 cartons...
>> Brian: Here's what we are going to do... every drug or supplement that I ingest, I don't look at the research. I look at anecdotal evidence on reddit so that's what going to do (laughter)
>> Katie: Ok yeah. I want to know what Reddit has to say about it.
>> Brian: "How much oat milk is too much oat milk... reddit" (laughs)
>> Chris: While you do that, should I pour... I have extra creamy and chocolate. Dark chocolate.
>> Katie: Ohhh, I want to try dark chocolate. Brian which one do you want?
>> Brian: Beautiful. The first hit. I want the regular because I am a real purist.
>> Chris: I don't have the regular or original. But this is just a creamier version of that. It tastes the same.
>> Brian: What do you mean it is a creamier version?
>> Chris: It's extra creamy.
>> Brian: It's extra creamy?
>> Chris: It's sort of like a half and half.
>> Brian: What does that do? How did they make it extra creamy? Did they milk the oats? (laughter)
>> Chris: I don't know. Did they fold?
>> Katie: How do you.... (laughs)
>> Chris: Milk an oat?
>> Brian: Basically they build an oat cow and they milk the udders and everyone watches (laughs)
>> Katie: (laughs) This is a literary podcast.
>> Chris: I just picture them soaking oatmeal and then getting in there like grape stomping but with oats.
>> Brian: Oh yes. I love that. I'm half Italian so I can't get into that.
>> Katie: You're going to get barefoot into a vat of oats and then just stomp them (laughter)
>> Brian: Oh first line. Ok the title of this Reddit post, and this is the first hit on Google, "Oat milk is getting trendy but is it really all that healthy?" Scandal. First line "from what I understand of unsweetened oat milk" well it's actually spelled "unsweeted" (laughs)
>> Katie: Unsweated?
>> Brian: No, it's with two e's.
>> Katie: Oh ok.
>> Brian: "Unsweeted oat milk is made by soaking oatmeal in water." That sounds like making oatmeal to be quite honest (laughter).
>> Chris: And then it's pouring out the runoff.
>> Brian: So if I add oat milk to my oatmeal then I feel it's just oaty.
>> Chris: Yeah.
>> Brian: That's a good adjective actually. Oaty.
>> Chris: Extra oaty?
>> Brian: Yeah, on all of my new hip-hop hits, I'm just going to be like "yo, we extra oaty." (laughs)
>> Katie: We oaty.
>> Chris: You want the... ?
>> Brian: Yeah, the extra creamy. That's good. That's good. Let's go with that.
>> Chris: Katie, you want the dark chocolate?
>> Katie: Yes, I want to try that.
>> Brian: I'm not going to sip until like we're all...
>> Katie: I like how they said the mighty oak. The mighty oak. Why do I keep saying the mighty oak? (laughter) The mighty oat. And you have to give me a chocolate cookie with this.
>> Brian: Yeah ok. But you have to take a sip first. Like without... Sans cookie.
>> Katie: Ok.
>> Brian: I'm going to go oatmeal cookie with my creamy oat.
>> Chris: Oat on oat.
>> Brian: Oh we got Rosetta in the other room whining because she clearly wants some oat milk.
>> Katie: We are 10 minutes into this podcast and all we have talked about is oat milk.
>> Brian: Honestly I'm probably going to pump out a novel real quick this weekend after I have all of this oat milk.
>> Katie: Oh.
>> Brian: Alright cheers guys.
>> Chris: Cheers.
>> Katie: Yeah cheers. I already took my sip.
>> Brian: And I want everybody to describe their experience after they are done.
>> Katie: That is fine. That is delicious.
>> Brian: It's sumptuous. I would say it tastes like a creamier version of rice milk. Like a heartier version of rice milk.
>> Chris: I think almond milk but that's just because that's what I've had most recently.
>> Brian: No, you're right. I probably haven't had rice milk since '94 (laughter). To be honest I just pulled that out of my ass.
>> Katie: This is pretty good.
>> Brian: Mmm can you hear our mastication friends?
>> Chris: This is good shit.
>> Brian: Can you hear me mechanically digesting?
>> Chris: What's that is that once I am out of all 4 of these cartons that they sent me, I don't know where my life goes from there.
>> Brian: To the stars.
>> Katie: I think you need to get the other brands of oat milk competing for your love and your plug here.
>> Chris: Does Oatly need more? I feel like they are out of my league.
>> Katie: (laughs) Oatly?
>> Chris: Planet Oat is young and scrappy.
>> Katie: Oh ok, I see. They are the OG's of oat milk?
>> Chris: Maybe, they are the ones that I see around a lot.
>> Katie: It is pretty tasty, I'm not going to lie.
>> Brian: Oh no. Oh no.
>> Katie: Oh God.
>> Brian: The second paragraph of this post... I mean, I want to say that this is conjecture. I'm just the messenger. "It seems like a lesser 'milk' compared to other vegan options." What do you have to say Christopher Gonzalez in response to that claim as Planet Oat's / Planet Oak's official representative?
>> Chris: Well other vegan options haven't gotten in touch with me so (laughter) they can't be shit.
>> Brian: Woah. Very business savvy answer right there.
>> Chris: I'm trying to get another shipment here (laughs)
>> Katie: Wait. Just because we are eating these cookies... you're not vegan, right?
>> Chris: No. I had like 4 meat products today (laughter)
>> Katie: Ok. I was like "oh shit, I hope he's not vegan, we just fed him..."
>> Chris: What's in these cookies?
>> Katie: I mean, they're not vegan cookies. There's egg in them.
>> Chris: Yeah.
>> Brian: The last line "Anyone know a lot about oat milk? What's the point?" (laughter) "I've tried the Pacific and the Oatly... the Oatly... I like that. The Oatly versions.. and they both tasted like leftover cereal milk." You know what? Who is this? User highlighterblue... fuck you man. I'm highly enjoying this (laughs)
>> Katie: Ok, I have some literary questions for you (laughs).
>> Chris: (laughs) A natural segue.
>> Katie: But I think every once in a while I would respect an oak milk... that is really... I either want to say oak milk or oatmeal.
>> Brian: Or Planet Oak.
>> Katie: I'm really struggling with this one today.
>> Brian: Oak milk. Planet Oak. Oatmeal (laughs)
>> Katie: I think you should throw a random oat... milk... fact at us once in a while.
>> Brian: Oh yeah, that's beautiful.
>> Chris: Oh God. I don't think I have that many. But sure, we can try.
>> Katie: We'll savor them. We'll savor them throughout this podcast.
>> Brian: Oh yeah.
>> Katie: Chris, we met you... How long ago was that? That was a couple months ago when you came inor was it last month?
>> Chris: Yeah, last month.
>> Katie: Wow. I met you through Mike Tager over at Mason jar press. Shout out to our friends at Mason Jar Press again. How do you know them, by the way? Your book's not out with them, right?
>> Chris: I don't have a book, but thank you for reminding me (laughs)
>> Katie: I don't have one either
>> Brian: We'll just bring you in to remind you
>> Chris: Scold me.
>> Katie: Well usually he sends me his authors who have just had a book come out. And so at first, when he first emailed me, I was like, "Oh, yeah, of course. Any of yours." So I just wonder how you knew them to begin with.
>> Chris: I think I've known him probably as long as I've been a part of Barrelhouse on Twitter, at least. But I didn't meet him in person until fairly recently. I think in Pittsburgh. Barrelhouse writer conference that we do in Pittsburgh back in October.
>> Brian: So you guys do your own conference?
>> Chris: Yeah, the next ones actually coming up on... April 27th? I think that's a Saturday.
>> Katie: Yeah, I was talking with Mike about the one in the fall because I think you guys are open to pitches from different places, right?
>> Chris: Yeah. Yeah.
>> Katie: I think we might pitch something.
>> Brian: Pitches for what exactly? For people setting up booths or something? Like what do you mean?
>> Chris: Craft workshops or panels I believe.
>> Katie: Yeah, well, that's really cool. Yeah. Can you just frame the conference just a little bit?
>> Chris: Yeah. So anyone who's familiar with AWP, it's...
>> Brian: We will be.
>> Chris: Are you going?
>> Katie: We'll be going.
>> Chris: I'll be there.
>> Brian: Yeah, that's right. You couldn't read at our place because you're so popular, you know? The oat milk people need you to... you're doing a press conference.
>> Chris: I'm doing a two hour oat milk related reading. (laughter) God. Can you imagine anything worse?
>> Brian: I've actually just gotten word that they're pulling you in on the cap table and they're thinking about making you, like, serious like CEO or CFO.
>> Katie: Of Planet Oak. (laughter)
>> Brian: Which is their shell company where they launder all their all their milk money.
>> Chris: You know, I thought it was going to be... when I got that initial email, I really thought it was gonna be like, Fyre festival level of like, I don't believe this for a second. And it took a couple of days before she got back to me with, like, tracking information for the package, which was 25 pounds. And also, I thought, this can't be real.
>> Brian: I know we want to talk about the Barrelhouse stuff, but, like I'm not I'm not satisfied yet with the oat milk stuff.
>> Katie: We were there for two seconds (laughs)
>> Brian: Because honestly, what is this package and what exactly are you doing for them?
>> Chris: Not a damn thing. They didn't even say, "could you In exchange for tweets..."
>> Brian: They just sent you oat milk.
>> Chris: They just sent me oat milk. But I did take a photo and hashtag that sponsored content.
>> Brian: And was that required?
>> Chris: No, which, honestly, they maybe should have asked me to do something.
>> Brian: So was this their publicist.
>> Chris: I think it was just like an account coordinator.
>> Brian: Oh they need a publicist or something.
>> Katie: But clearly they know what they're doing. Because right now we're sitting on a podcast talking about oat milk.
>> Brian: Or we don't know what we're doing.
>> Katie: That's true. We could be getting money from planet oat (laughter)
>> Chris: I want to cut. So I could buy more oat milk because now I have to buy it.
>> Brian: Listen, you pay me a million dollars then I'm putting $995,000 and do put it into preferred stock. (laughter)
>> Chris: Yeah, I'm sure it's taking off. That wouldn't be bad.
>> Katie: So the Barrelhouse?
>> Brian: Yeah. Yeah, that was actually less... Yeah, that was less interesting than I thought it would be. Not the oat milk thing. That is interesting. I was hoping that they were really putting you up on the pedestal.
>> Chris: No, no, no, no.
>> Brian: They're incompetent. Clearly.
>> Chris: There goes your sponsorship.
>> Katie: Brian, you just screwed this.
>> Brian: No, you know, I don't know. You know, I'm ready. I'm ready to work with them. That's what I'm saying. Like I'm ready to work with them.
>> Chris: Yeah, I think it was just free publicity. They didn't even retweet my tweet. They liked it. I don't know how many followers that they have now. They had, like, five at the time. The account was started in October, but they really hadn't been tweeting since about 4 weeks ago.
>> Brian: Who are these people? Like are we going to die from this oat milk?
>> Chris: It's a good way to go. It's pretty tasty.
>> Brian: Yeah, my taste buds are absolutely jumping.
>> Katie: Is it @Planet_Oat? Oh, yep, that's definitely what it is. They have nine followers now and four tweets.
>> Brian: Woah. Let's tweet at them.
>> Katie: Okay, we're about to tweet at them. So the barrelhouse conference?
>> Chris: Yeah, but it's like a less overwhelming version of a AWP. It's also way more affordable, and it's very much about writers across any level. But I feel like a lot of people who get the most out of it are people just starting out and just really need a sort of an extra push. It's an opportunity to attend panels and workshops. There's also a speed dating type situation in which you're paired with an editor for like, five minutes, and they read maybe a page or two of your work and give you immediate feedback on that. And it's also just a great networking opportunity.
>> Katie: How long have they been doing that?
>> Chris: Oh, God, I'm going to get this wrong, but maybe twelve years.
>> Katie: Oh, wow.
>> Chris: If not more or something like that. Way before I joined.
>> Brian: Is this a paid subscription for Barrelhouse? Like, how did they put this together?
>> Chris: It's through a lot of his partnerships. The Pittsburgh one takes place at Chatham University, I think. I hope I didn't butcher that in Pittsburgh and one of their Barrelhouse editors, Sheila, I think heads the MFA program there. So we have it there in the fall.
>> Brian: Christopher just had an oat milk burp (laughter).
>> Katie: Which was soothing and refreshing.
>> Brian: So please, everyone remembers that you can feed your babies oat milk and then burp them.
>> Chris: OK.
>> Katie: OK.
>> Chris: Was it the oak milk or the wine that I had before it?
>> Brian: It was the oat milk (laughs)
>> Katie: Yeah. The rose and dark chocolate milk combo here is...
>> Brian: And the cookies.
>> Katie: And the cookie is just really working from the chase.
>> Brian: I'm about to chase my oat milk and cookies with Cerose and then chase that...
>> Katie: Give me another cookie.
>> Brian: Which: oatmeal or...?
>> Katie: Oatmeal raisin. Oakmeal. Oak meat (laughter). Give me that oak meat. Do you present anything at the Barrelhouse conference?
>> Chris: Yes. So the one in the spring, which is in the DC/Arlington area is at Mason... Sorry. Yeah. Mason University, right? That's a place. I should know all of this. George Mason.
>> Brian: George Mason? Yeah, I know them because they miraculously went to the Final Four about fifteen years ago.
>> Chris: Fifteen years?
>> Brian: Yeah.
>> Chris: You've held onto that?
>> Brian: I have. It was great.
>> Chris: But yeah, it's that, uh, is that George Mason on April 27th, and I will be doing two panels. One is a general editor's panel. So literary mag editors, I think four of us are doing it. We just talk about general advice, tips for writers submitting to journals. What to do, what not to do and answering any questions. And then another one I'm doing, which I pitched along with Split Lips editor-in-chief Caitlin Andrews Rice. She and I decided to do a panel called What we talk about when we talk about or what we mean when we talk about literary patience and sort of just talking about, like, taking your time with your work. Revising.
>> Brian: Oh, I'm all on board with this.
>> Chris: And we're on that panel with... I don't know anyone's names. This is terrible. Tyler Barton?
>> Brian: The title of this episode will be "oat milk?".
>> Chris: Chris can't remember anything past 6 PM Yeah
>> Brian: "Is oat milk vegan?"
>> Chris: Tyler Bartin, who co-founded Fear No Lit and Ivelisse Rodriguez, who is the author of "Love War Stories", a short story collection. And she's also one of our featured authors at the conference.
>> Katie: Oh cool.
>> Brian: Nice. Very cool.
>> Chris: It's gonna be an event-filled day. It's gonna be a lot of fun. I've only ever been to the one in Pittsburgh, so this will be my first time doing the DC conference, but I'm stoked.
>> Brian: We should try to get down there.
>> Katie: Oh definitely.
>> Brian: My parents live in DC.
>> Chris: Swing through. Do it.
>> Katie: I was going to ask... so I want to go back to that literary patience.
>> Brian: Yes, I was going to ask about that too.
>> Katie: Go ahead.
>> Brian: Do you have a question?
>> Katie: I was going to make one up.
>> Brian: Oh ok. My question was basically gonna be what are your thoughts on literary patience? Was this a preconceived thing? Did you guys say we're interested specifically in this topic? Or was it handed to you by Barrelhouse?
>> Chris: No, it was just Caitlin and I. So I'm also a contributing editor at Split Lip, which just because I get to consult, like, weigh some flash fiction submissions. But Caitlin and I were just discussing sort of how Twitter, which we could talk about more. But Twitter is...
>> Brian: Oh, we will
>> Chris: (laughs) ...sort of makes you think like publishing happens fast. People are publishing all the time, which is amazing, but some people are slower. And I think I've reached a point in my writing where I understand that like I'm a little slow at drafting.
>> Katie: Same
>> Chris: I'm slow at revising aim, and I've accepted it, and I think I'm prouder of my work. Because of that, I've accepted it. So I think this just came from this idea that there's no reason to rush. There's no reason to, you know, publish work early. It happens when it happens and you should not feel pressure about that.
>> Brian: You're speaking my gospel right now.
>> Chris: And I think it's important because Twitter makes you think and can make you think that like you're falling behind. But really you're not. And you know there are people who can write quickly and publish fast, and that's great for them. You know there's no one way to do it.
>> Brian: The only way to do it is to do it well.
>> Chris: Yeah and whatever that means for you.
>> Brian: Exactly. Yeah, I know what you mean. Especially with self publishing these days, because anyone can, like press X, you know, ninety thousand times and then copy and paste it and then publish it.
>> Chris: Did you read my work in progress? (laughter)
>> Katie: It's called Oak Milk? (laughter)
>> Brian: Yeah. It's the evolution of binary. I don't even know what it is. You have to split the photons and the screen to see what's behind the X (laughs).
>> Katie: I would really like to see an experimental flash fiction piece on oat milk from you. I feel like that's coming.
>> Chris: Oh God. I think it has to.
>> Brian: Hook me up with some here. Let me kill the extra creamy real quick.
>> Katie: The chocolate is delish. Divine.
>> Brian: I'm sure it is. And much to the chagrin of this Redditor, I'm sure it has sugar added.
>> Chris: And you know what? Nothing wrong with. I'm not drinking this as a milk alternative, which I guess is why I'm like, who cares.
>> Katie: Do you like regular amounts?
>> Chris: In cereal, I don't drink it.
>> Katie: I don't like it either. He drinks a glass of milk like a fuckin serial killer. It's disgusting.
>> Brian: Well just the last couple days have been buying milk. I got to say, it doesn't make my tummy feel very well. So oat milk...
>> Chris: I think the same for me.
>> Katie: So, the oat milk is a good alternative.
>> Chris: From Planet Oak.
>> Brian: There's no lactase in it. Or no, lactase is what we use to break down lactose. I think. Don't quote me. I'm not a scientist. I'm a writer.
>> Katie: So you were saying about Twitter, though?
>> Chris: Yeah. Twitter.
>> Katie: Brian is new to Twitter. Relatively. He's been on it for a couple of years but he never really used it. And I've taught him the secret.
>> Brian: Oh, yeah, I had like ninety followers for five years and then she taught me how to use it, like, two or three weeks ago. Now I almost have 2,000.
>> Chris: Holy shit. It took me, like, five years just to get what I have which isn't 2,000 (laughs). I need these secrets from Katie.
>> Katie: I will tell you.
>> Brian: Yeah, but we're not gonna broadcast it.
>> Katie: Yeah, no.
>> Chris: No, no.
>> Brian: If oat milk, Planet Oat... If you want my publicity skills, you've gotta pay. (laughs) With you and your nine followers.
>> Chris: I think that's fair.
>> Katie: What's the point of Twitter From your point of view?
>> Chris: I really do think it varies per person. I think it can be your news source. You can. I mean, that's risky, but it sort of can be a constant stream of news for me, though It's really about community building and just meeting other writers. There are so many pockets of Twitter that exist that I haven't even explored which is kind of crazy, like stan Twitter is completely ridiculous.
>> Katie: What is stan Twitter?
>> Chris: Twitter is like teenagers...
>> Brian: You're an obsessive fan of something. Like I'm a stan of ASAP Rocky.
>> Katie: So if you were part of stan Twitter, ASAP Rocky would be your avatar, and you would just tweet constant ASAP Rocky news and retweet things. You would put down other stans.
>> Katie: Is there like a hashtag this follows? Or is it different Twitter users that make up their own like I would make up my own avatar as ASAP?
>> Chris: Yeah, yeah, and you just sort of find other people like that. I mean, it's like literary Twitter sort of exists but there's no... I mean there's #amwriting and other hashtags.
>> Katie: I think that it's the #writingcommunity that's the biggest one of all.
>> Brian: #amwriting gets more tweets, I would say.
>> Katie: Maybe.
>> Brian: It does, but yeah, the writing community's kind of the base. But I want to talk about the etymology of Stan. Do you know where it comes from?
>> Chris: From the Eminem song?
>> Brian: Yeah, from the Eminem song.
>> Katie: Oh, that's where it comes from?
>> Brian: Yeah. So he's, like obsessed with Eminem, the character. So if you're a stan then...
>> Katie: So you're a crazy ASAP fan and I'm...
>> Brian: I'm not a stan of anything really.
>> Katie: Chris, are you a stan of oat milk now?
>> Chris: Well check my avatar now. (laughter) I don't know. No, I'm not a stan. I don't have the energy.
>> Brian: That's because you haven't had enough oat milk, really. What do you think about Twitter? Because I spent, like, years shitting on Twitter. Now I'm using it and I'm very well dissonant.
>> Chris: What were your problems with Twitter?
>> Brian: It's a cesspool.
>> Chris: Yeah.
>> Brian: You know, in democracy, everyone gets a vote. I don't think everyone should, like, you know? (laughter)
>> Chris: Okay.
>> Katie: Wow.
>> Brian: Straight up. (laughs)
>> Chris: Is this a literary podcast or a political...
>> Katie: Is this about men's rights suddenly?
>> Brian: Actually no. That's not what I'm saying at all.
>> Chris: I feel like I'm on a talk show (laughs)
>> Brian: So, for example, if you look at it, if you look at brexit, that's a perfect example. You give everyone a vote on something, they don't know what the fuck they're talking about then that's what you get (laughs). You know? I'm serious. Anyway, that's my point about Twitter. It's that you get all the voices, and some people, I shouldn't be talking about certain things.
>> Katie: Well, sure.
>> Chris: Sure, you know, I think that happens everywhere, on and off Twitter.
>> Katie: That's kind of the beauty.
>> Brian: I'm half joking. But that's why I have...
>> Katie: No, I agree with you there that the literary community is super strong on Twitter. I mean more so than any other platform. And that's good. That's where we have the majority of our followers for Animal Riot. It's on Twitter because it's so huge. The Writers of Instagram is kind of just like a...
>> Chris: God. I haven't even tried.
>> Katie: Oh people like post their crappy poems on a Canva made photo and that's pretty much what it is.
>> Chris: Like they spent more time on the photo than the actual poem?
>> Katie: Yeah.
>> Chris: Now I think Twitter's great because it is all about the words at the end of the day and I think that's why maybe writers were drawn to it.
>> Katie: Yeah, we've been meaning a ton of people. It's been really great for that. That's kind of what we want to do with our press anyway is build a community and be able to talk with writers one on one and have more meaningful conversations as a publisher. And so Twitter's been a really great outlet for that. But it is definitely a time suck sometimes.
>> Chris: Yeah, yeah. When I'm at work, my email is one tab and Twitter is the other. And it's just sort of like there is that element to it that you feel like if you step away for too long you've missed out on something. And that's not necessarily healthy. But I've accepted that about myself. I will live and die on Twitter.
>> Katie: Your tweets make my day most of the day. And I tweeted at Chris because every time I popped up Twitter has that new algorithm now where it's not just uploading, like, you know, whatever is new, it's doing who you interact with, I guess? It's trying to pull some Facebook shit.
>> Chris:: Yeah. I'm not a huge fan.
>> Katie: But yours kept popping up first because I guess I'd commented on two things and then suddenly all your tweets were popping up first. I was like, Chris, I swear I'm not stalking you. But your work tweets are particularly hilarious to me because I will also be at work trolling Twitter and you'll pop up something about hot wings and a Diet Coke like you did the other day (laugh). What's your Twitter handle so people could go follow you?
>> Chris: @livesinpages.
>> Katie: Oh that's right. @livesinpages.
>> Brian: And your photo is like the Obama Hope Photo. (laughter) I love it.
>> Chris: I needed a new author's photo and it was time.
>> Brian: It's beautiful. I love it. It's not like demagogue ish (laughter)
>> Chris: Thank God.
>> Brian: Who's what? What's your cover photo right here?
>> Chris: That is Raul Esparcia and... shit I can't remember the name... from the 2006 Broadway revival of Company, which is one of my favorite musicals.
>> Katie: Wow.
>> Chris: Yeah, I also tweet about Company a lot because it's sort of always on my mind.
>> Brian: Does that conflict with the oat milk stipulation in your contract that you must tweet zero times a day about oat milk?
>> Chris: (laughs) No.
>> Katie: Are you a theater person as well?
>> Chris: I enjoy it. I don't perform, I don't act. But I love some musical theater. It's my shit. And, like, Company is one of those musicals that I think I was just introduced two years ago, a friend mentioned it, and then I went back and listened and watched because that one was recorded the 2006 Broadway production and became obsessed and I'm still obsessed. So if I were a stan, I guess it would be for Company specifically. But I don't think there's much traction. Maybe, I don't know.
>> Katie: Speaking of your work, though... you started to talk about that before the podcast. Where do you work?
>> Chris: I work at McMillan Publishers in their digital production department.
>> Katie: Does your work ever ask you where your book is?
>> Chris: They could not be less interested. There are many people who work in publishing who write. A lot of people in editorial who do. In my department there are three of us who write. The company couldn't care less.
>> Katie: Yeah. So, Yeah, in terms of that, where are you with your work right now?
>> Chris: I'm working on a collection and it's you know, as I mentioned before, it's slow going...
>> Brian: Oh short stories?
>> Chris: Of short stories, yeah. It took awhile for me to figure out what... because I didn't want to just write a bunch of stories and then decide they should be in a collection which I know is one way to do it. You sort of just write stories over time. And then you're like, I have ten, fifteen, twenty. I really wanted it to be a cohesive project that felt thematically linked. So it took awhile to get to a point where I thought, this is the angle to the collection. So now I'm working towards it and trying to stick to, you know, writing stories in that vein, even if they don't all end up in the collection.
>> Katie: Do you have anything you typically write about it?
>> Chris: I've been writing a lot about stories of exploring my queer identity in recent years. I just recently came out to my family as bisexual. So I think part of it was I felt freer exploring that on the page than I did in my day to day. Even though, in New York, my life in New York, in my life around friends, I'm pretty open now. But it was a way to sort of put a lot of that on the page and work through it.
>> Katie: How was that with your family?
>> Chris: It was good. It was one of those things that, like, I didn't know how it was going to play out, and I didn't know how to talk about it. But my mom, like, saw a tweet that I did and brought it up to me, and I was glad she did, because it sort of just opened the conversation and it was quick, and she immediately was like, "You know, you don't have to hide this part of yourself." So that was nice.
>> Katie: Wow.
>> Chris: That's also a thing on Twitter that... especially in the last year, I feel like I've been more open about it in general with people. Especially my newer Twitter friends or whatever, they only know me as the person they meet on Twitter. So there was no idea of who I was before or anything with family, so I could just kind of be myself from the jump.
>> Brian: Was your family surprised?
>> Chris: No. They had been thinking about it for years. They were like "I'm sure he's gay", which, honestly, I'm glad that they sort of arrived at that and work that out amongst themselves. And that it was the first time anyone's directly asked me in my family. And you know, I never dated anyone and all that stuff. I mean, we can go down that route if you want to. But like I never brought anyone home and never introduced them to anyone.
>> Brian: You mean man or women?
>> Chris: Yeah, man or woman.
>> Brian: So how old are you?
>> Chris: Twenty six.
>> Brian: Twenty six. OK. Yeah. I mean, still, that's still relatively late (laughs). I don't know about the average age these days. But I mean, like as a person as a human. I'm saying it's a lot to hold onto, you know?
>> Chris: I mean, it wasn't like I didn't realize I was bi until, like, towards the end of college. And so it was only five years or so of holding onto it I guess.
>> Katie: Yeah, I like I have never said that to my family... like, I have a male partner now, but I'm pretty much... like I used to say, bisexual. Somebody told me once that I was pansexual, and I was like, I don't really know if I like any kind of label. Just tend to be a little bit more fluid in the partners that I've dated, but I've never really had that conversation with my family. Who knows who will listen to this (laughter)
>> Chris: Yeah. It never came up because dating never came up.
>> Katie: Yeah, same.
>> Chris: But it is nice to know that if I do have a partner who isn't a woman, it won't have to be a thing to talk about down the line.
>> Brian: Is it strictly... and feel free to not answer this. It's fine. Is it strictly a societal factor that keeps you from knowing until later on?
>> Chris: I think that's a large question.
>> Brian: It is. It's a huge question. I'm just really curious.
>> Chris: I mean, I think for me and I could only really speak to me, I guess. But I remember their were periods where early on where I thought am I straight or gay. And I think it's such a binary in society where you're not...
>> Brian: Especially when we were younger.
>> Chris: And especially when we were younger. I think like once I got to college the idea of bisexuality or pansexuality became much more of like a concrete idea. But when you're younger, any interest in a boy means you're gay? There's no in between.
>> Brian: Yeah. Even I distinctly remember the episode on Sex and the City where there...
>> Chris: Oh, God. That's a painful episode.
>> Katie: Oh yeah.
>> Brian: Where Sarah Jessica Parker is like "There's no such thing as bi. If you like the other sex then you're gay."
>> Chris: It's a terrible episode. It's one that doesn't age well.
>> Brian: Yeah. But it's one of those things were back then it was like "Oh, yeah, well, they celebrate gay people. Cool." You know where now it's completely ridiculous. Like who cares what you are? I've always been very intrigued by the learning process because... I'm reading a book now and I won't get into this again. You all know Harari, like, a billion times an episode. We should have a contest between who do I bring up more: him or Sergio de la Pava? (laughs) He's been on here. He's like my hero. Great. Now I know I'm still a stalker.
>> Chris: You are a Sergio stan.
>> Katie: Yeah he is. You are a Sergio stan.
>> Brian: I'm a stan? Yeah, that's my stan. Oh my God. Let's email him afterwards (laughter). But anyway, so he's gay. He's not bi, he's just gay. But this is one of the smartest people I've ever read. This guy makes you see everything from an angle that you've never seen before. It's unbelievable, and he does it in extremely cogent terms. This is the third book by him I've read, and it's the first time he's... no. He's talked about being gay and his other books, but he explicitly states that it wasn't until he was in college that he realized. To me more than anything that just shows how much oven influencing factor society has been. Because why else would that be such a... I didn't need to figure out that I liked women. That wasn't something that I needed to learn when I was twenty one. You know what I'm saying? Like that, that it's extremely oppressive. I hope it's better for kids like today, but you know.
>> Chris: I hope so. There's definitely more media representation than even when we were kids, right?
>> Brian: And for the first time, we're seeing commercials with gay couples and stuff like that. It didn't happen even five years ago. You barely almost never saw that. Yeah, just acknowledging that it's like it exists in the world, right?
>> Chris: Right.
>> Brian: And it's totally normal, you know? And it's totally represented across like sentient life forms, you know?
>> Chris: (laughs) Yeah
>> Brian: But anyway, okay, so we didn't shit on Twitter enough. But that's fine. We can move on.
>> Katie: But we discovered you are a stan of Sergio's. That's one thing.
>> Brian: Yeah.
>> Katie: Chris, I'm wondering if you would share a little bit of your work with us now if you're up for it because you read at Animal Riot. And it was so lovely.
>> Chris: Oh, thank you. Also, yeah that was so much fun. I think I told you, maybe slightly tipsily that Animal Riot is one of my favorite reading series in New York.
>> Katie: Thank you. Yeah we tend to drink quite a bit at Animal Riot (laughs)
>> Brian: And this will be actually my first experience here because when you came to read. I...
>> Chris: Yeah, you weren't there.
>> Brian: I had fallen asleep on the couch from working so much in the month of January that...
>> Katie: That was the day that we also had a reading series before Animal Riot.
>> Brian: Yeah, that was your, you read right?
>> Katie: I read at a reading at 3 PM that day and we had wine starting at 2 o'Clock.
>> Chris: So you were just constantly buzzed?
>> Katie: Yeah. Oh, I was. And I came home and I took a thirty minute nap in between that reading series and Animal Riot. And then I tried to wake him up on the couch, and he wouldn't even move.
>> Brian: All I remember is you being like you're going to stay here. And I was like, yes please (laughs).
>> Katie: So Brian didn't get to hear you.
>> Chris: So I have a flash story called A Mountain of Invertebrates and it hasn't been published.
>> Katie: Ohh so you can pick it up, people listening.
>> Chris: Or it's terrible. We'll find out together.
>> Brian: You can transcribe it and plagiarize it if you wish. No, we'll find you. We're stans.
>> Chris: Thank you. You're gonna have an alert on Twitter.
Austin orders an entire seafood boil for himself. He ignores the crawfish and halved cobs of
corn, focusing instead on the crab legs, which he cracks open with such force the buttery juices
mist Jorge’s face. Jorge’s plate is nearly empty now. He had devoured his crispy-fried cod
sandwich in five minutes and spends the rest of their meal together picking at coleslaw, catching
only two or three strands of wet cabbage at a time on his fork. Austin finishes a fourth crab leg
and leans back in his chair. He drapes a napkin over his lap. That was delightful, he says, but I
can’t eat another bite. Austin smiles at Jorge, his teeth flecked with parsley. You should try
some, he says. But seafood is not Jorge’s thing. The ocean, he believes, is swarming with aliens. No need to search for them in outer space when they lurk in the darkest depths of the earth. And certainly no reason to eat them. To roll the aquatic flesh around in his mouth would be an act against God. Hard pass, he thinks. But there was still so much shrimp and sausage and crawfish and potatoes cooling out on the newspapered tabletop. He imagines biting into the untouched crawfish, now: some uneasy chewing to start, then a rough swallow. Then, he suspects, the dead little fucker would be revived by the bath of his stomach acid. Reborn, it would swim down, deeper into his gut, burrowing itself within him forever. Jorge, you really must try some, Austin says again. Just one bite, please. He grabs a lobster from the pile, twists its body, and pulls until the tail separates from its torso. They could get a to-go container. There is still time. It’s what other couples might do: wrap up the remains and tote the bounty back to Jorge’s apartment, to be later consumed in a post-sex haze. But that never happens, does it? Jorge sees into next morning, and he knows Austin would leave the bag in his fridge, as he had done with a slice of vodka pizza from their first date, and the stuffed cabbage from date two, and the Thai food from the third. The chocolate cake from date four never made it home. But for all those other leftovers, Jorge made sure to eat them. He was raised to be a garbage disposal. No waste, never. He picks over whatever Austin leaves in the mornings, shortly after Austin vanishes into the backseat of a Lyft. Off to class or work, Austin says. Alone in his kitchen, scraping his fork against the aluminum takeout container, Jorge watches the Lyft app every time, notes how the driver passes Austin’s job, and the school, and even his apartment. Jorge watches Austin slip away, upstream. Austin is squeezing the lobster’s torso now, and the red shell compresses under his fingers, cracking. Juice rains down over the newspaper. From the carnage Austin presents Jorge with a lump of yellowish-green meat pulp, balanced delicately on his fingertips. That’s it? Jorge laughs, he has to, everything feels too wild. So much effort and mess? All of that for so little? He’s serious. He’s confused. You’ll see what all the fuss is about, Austin says. He swears it, raises the mass to Jorge’s face. Jorge thinks about the bag of seafood, how it will surely sag, the paper thinning out over time, long after tonight, eventually breaking open all over his bottom shelf. Rancid garlic butter everywhere and a mountain of invertebrates left to rot. Jorge opens his mouth, welcomes Austin’s fingers. He rolls the meat on his tongue, fights against the stinging in his eyes and rising bile in his throat, tries to push through. Austin is a wide smile and two celebratory balled fists. So good right? he gasps. I knew you’d love it. But Jorge is still chewing the lobster, nodding his head over and over again. The hope is the movement will guide the sea bug down his throat and he can will himself into saying this thing is good. The hope is it won’t be a lie.
>> Katie: Ohh
>> Brian: Interesting.
>> Chris: Reading always makes me nervous (laughs).
>> Katie: Get a cold glass of oat milk to wet your whistle.
>> Brian: What is Jorge and Austin's fate? Do you think?
>> Chris: They're not meant to last.
>> Brian: That's what I got.
>> Chris: Yeah.
>> Brian: I thought there was a hint of, perhaps treachery. When I heard when going past his job past his work, I was like, that's interesting.
>> Chris: Yeah. Yeah. What I think when I was writing it, their relationship is not defined, and Jorge wants it to be but Austin doesn't.
>> Brian: Yeah, I see.
>> Katie: How do you know... I'm always very impressed by people who can write flash fiction because I have tried my hand at it many times, and I just always feel unfinished or unable to capture something in so few words. So what drove you to start writing flash fiction? How do you feel about it? What does it make you feel?
>> Chris: Yeah, it's a lot of fun. I think when I first started writing flash, it had a lot of drafts for longer stories. They were kind of dead stories. They weren't working longer. We're talking like 2,000-3,000 words. But there were still parts of them that I liked and wanted to keep. And so I cut down and refined and sort of stripped away any bloat.
>> Brian: And a lot of times, the information that you thought wasn't in that part is in there, you know? And those parts that you stripped away, it's still there.
>> Chris: Yeah. It was just about sort of enhancing and making it stronger those parts that really worked, which I found I could do through shortening and compression and then the story would be about a thousand words instead of two thousand. That's sort of how I started writing flash.
>> Katie: Is your collection all flash?
>> Chris: No, I don't think so. I think it might be a mix of flash and longer. That's the hope, because I still struggle with writing longer.
>> Brian: That would be quite a number of stories if they were mostly flash.
>> Chris: Yeah, and it can work. This story that I read... maybe I've been kicking it around for, like, five to six months. Some of my flash can take a while. Some of it, not all of it, but some of them can take longer, short stories, even for me. So if I was doing like, forty flash stories for a collection or something, I don't know how long it takes me to do.
>> Katie: I mean, I write really so slowly too. I mean your first draft of your novel. Brian, the very first draft... How long did that take you?
>> Brian: Less than a year. But I threw the entire thing out. But it took me. I wouldn't advise to do what I do.
>> Katie: Yeah. It took me two and a half years to finally finish the first draft of my novel.
>> Chris: Yeah, but it was infinitely better than my first draft, you know? So it's just kind of a different process, you know? I mean, I was like, 23, 24 when I started. At the same time, I still think if I wrote another draft, I don't think I'd have to toss it all, but it would definitely... There would be more drafts before I called it the first draft.
>> Chris: Yeah. Nothing is ever for me is ever a first draft. It's made up of many drafts.
>> Brian: Even Katie looked over it once or twice before she called it a first draft. Do you have any plans to write long form or are you strictly a short form writer?
>> Chris: Eventually I do have an idea for a novel that I've been kicking around for a couple years. That's usually a good sign that it's worth pursuing for me if I haven't stopped thinking about it for two, three, or five years. I think I want to do the short story collection first because it's really urgent in my mind. Or the energy is... Yeah, my undergrad thesis was a novel, so I've done it before. I haven't done it again but I have written in long form.
>> Brian: Would you ever revisit that, or is that just...
>> Chris: I tried.
>> Brian: Yeah. I mean, I wrote like, three novels before this one, and it's not worth going back to.
>> Chris: No because I look at it and I can think of things that I could improve and do better but like I don't want to put in the time.
>> Brian: A lot of times it's like an original sin problem. There is a spark that, you know, galvanised you to write the novel. But it was kind of flawed and the whole organization of the idea would need to be rearranged. And by the time you're X years past that you probably like you said, You have this novel idea kicking around. You have ideas that you're more burning to write. But I know what you mean. Katie has this novel, the "Sideshow Children" that she started in grad school and then she put down to write this which is the working title "Sunny". But she's thinking about going back to that one too. But since since I almost finished the last draft of this one, this one that's coming out in September, I've had one for about two years now that I've been thinking of and I drafted it a little bit, but that idea when it sticks with you for a while... it can even shift a lot, you know? But it's still that that the zeitgeist or like, gestalt of that idea is still there.
>> Chris: Yeah and I consider all of it part of the writing process. Like though I haven't sat down and put any of it on the page, it's been marinating. And when I do come to the page, I think it will be a stronger idea than if I just ran to it immediately.
>> Brian: Oh, yeah, definitely. Yeah, absolutely. I think one of the biggest things I've learned even in this first novel that I'm gonna publish, I did not plan enough and that's why I tossed the whole first draft and all that stuff. And it's not like you have to outline, but you do have to have to say, "Oh, I know what I'm doing here". And then that can shift and mutate and everything like that. But you know, you have to be somewhat certain of something combined with a certain uncertainty. Yeah, I definitely made that mistake. And I think that's why I rewrote it twenty times.
>> Chris: Yeah.
>> Katie: So we're coming up on an hour here, the close of it. And I'm just wondering if you, Chris, would hit us with some outgoing oat milk tweets.
>> Chris: God, I don't know if I have any.
>> Katie: What are these?
>> Chris: They sent him an oat milk back sheet, but it's more for Planet Oat specifically. But I can tell you...
>> Brian: I don't understand their business model. (laughter)
>> Chris: I don't know if I can hit you with any facts. There aren't that many facts. I can tell you about caloric breakdown.
>> Brian: Made with oats.
>> Katie: What is in oat milk? Or did we already cover that?
>> Brian: What if I pack the oat... What if I packed the oak milk?
>> Katie: See, you cannot say it. It's so hard. Oat milk.
>> Brian: Goddamnit.
>> Chris: I can tell you that the dark chocolate has eight grams of sugar added, but the other ones don't. And there are three other flavors.
>> Katie: I like the dark chocolate.
>> Brian: What are the other flavors?
>> Chris: Original, extra creamy and vanilla. And earlier today I tweeted that I mixed the vanilla and the dark chocolate, and it was a delightful little treat.
>> Brian: Do you know what? We're going to settle this. I can not stop thinking about it. "Can you make oatmeal with oat milk."
>> Katie: I mean, yeah, you could make oatmeal with anything.
>> Chris: You can make it with cola if you want it.
>> Brian: Yeah. Okay, guys, let's be real.
>> Katie: Let's be serious here.
>> Chris: What does the Internet say?
>> Katie: Let's show me Reddit.
>> Brian: You guys are the kind of people that pour milk in before you put the cereal in the bowl. Okay? I don't appreciate that.
>> Katie: At least not the kind of people that drink a glass of milk at midnight, Brian. Like a stalker.
>> Brian: I only do it to pair with my drugs. (laughter)
>> Chris: Well in that case...
>> Brian: There's nothing. Honestly, I think we could be pioneers in this sector.
>> Katie: I think the next step for you, Chris, is that there's gotta be a photo shoot.
>> Chris: Oh God no (laughs)
>> Brian: We need to dress you in like, a diaper with, like, two spoons and then sit in a bowl of oat milk.
>> Katie: What? Why?
>> Brian: Because that's amazing.
>> Chris: I don't know if I'm ready for that. That kind of...
>> Brian: I'll do it. Listen, someone's got to step up.
>> Katie: I was more thinking of Chris in a tux with a martini glass of oat milk and pushing a cow out of the way. Like a guy in a cow suit, like pushing that away. That's the exclusivity that I'm thanking for oat milk that I've been thinking of.
>> Chris: I've been recently, like rewatching Olivia Coleman's Oscar acceptance speech. In that moment, where she looks down at the award and she's like, "This is hilarious"... That's sort of been my entire attitude about this whole process. Like every time I reach into the work... like all of the cartons I have are in my office fridge, and whenever I pull it out and like, this is so funny.
>> Katie: This is so funny. You're just savoring your oat milk.
>> Chris: I've been trying, but it's going fast.
>> Katie: They got to send you more Planet Oat.
>> Chris: Should I just email that same woman and like, "Can I get another? I need a fix.
>> Katie: You should really email her when we drop this episode and be like I plugged you guys on this podcast. Give me the hook up.
>> Brian: I really think we should. After we do the transcript, we should just send it to her and say, "Does this work?"
>> Katie: I already tweeted it.
>> Brian: No. I mean, like, we should send the transcript in an email and just say, "Does this work?" Just really vague. Like "does this work?"
>> Chris: Oh like subject line.
>> Brian: Please advise (laughter).
>> Chris: And then when they don't respond in a week, just circle back...
>> Katie: Still waiting on that shipment guys.
>> Chris: 25 pounds overnighted from Massachusetts.
>> Brian: We should also tweet, some Breaking Bad shit where it's like, "Oh, yeah, we just hit up when your milk truck shipments and were like holding it ransom for million's of oak trees" (laughs)
>> Katie: How many oats does it take to make a glass? Do we know that? Is that on the fact sheet?
>> Chris: We should Google it.
>> Brian: OK, I did Google The Minimalist Baker, who should pay me now, and how to make oat milk. Homemade, creamy oat milk with two ingredients in five minutes. We just blew up their spot, dude.
>> Katie: We're going to get off the podcast, and we're all going to fill up the bathtub...
>> Chris: (laughs) Oh my God
>> Katie: And we're going to stomp on some oats.
>> Brian: There's a picture. Guys, look. There's a picture of a blender with some water, and so there's a blender and then you have oat milk (laughs)
>> Katie: Oh it's just blended oats?
>> Brian: No, it's not blended oats. It looks a little more complicated. Ingredients: One cup rolled oats, four cups water, one pinch of salt... a date. Whoa, one, whole date. That's it. Just one date.
>> Chris: Woah. For sweetness? Must be.
>> Brian: Ok, anyway, we're gonna close it up.
>> Katie: Thanks, Chris, for being on the podcast.
>> Brian: This has been great. I have very much enjoyed my oat milk experience and I will be in touch. My people will be in touch with your people. They will get to the oat milk people. Planet Oak watch out.
>> Katie: Oak Milk people.
>> Chris: I love the idea of you reaching out to them directly and be like "We were on a podcast with Chris. You know, Chris..." (laughter)
>> Katie: He influenced us onto your...
>> Brian: (laughs) We have been influenced.
>> Katie: We would like some please.
>> Brian: Okay, that's it for today's episode. If you like what you heard, please subscribe and review on whichever platform you're listening on. You can get in touch with us on Twitter @animalriotpress. Or Facebook and Instagram at Animal Riot Press or through our website animalriotpress.com. This has been the 11th episode of the Animal Riot podcast with me, your host Brian Birnbaum, featuring Chris Gonzalez, whose work you can find at www.chris-gonzalez.com and is produced by Katie Rainey. Oh, and by the way, that's Gonzalez with a Z... 2 Z's. And is produced by Katie Rainey, without whom we would be merely three of Shakespeare's thousand monkeys banging on a typewriter.